Factions No short map lengths

Ledo_5678

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This is true, but map length is not the only Factor in what has changed. Peoples knowledge in and experience with the game itself has changed significantly over the years changing how people play. Not to mention the ease of competition elsewhere.

I personally much prefer longer maps, but I also know that if I was to return actively playing I would have significantly less time to dedicate to the game compared to 3.0 (Not to mention, in 3.0 base designs and cannon knowledge was hugely different). From my general observations factions these days are also significantly more proud than they used to, many Factions would rather leave or move servers than admit that they were raided or beaten by another Faction. (This has been observed on multiple servers in recent years), back in 3.0 there were very few competing servers with the player quality that Gontroller players looked for giving people greater incentive to rebuild, that is no longer the case. We are looking at various ways to retain players long term and reviewing the methods we added to Vaelox to see what sort of impact that had (Primarily in ease of base building and recovering, removing overclaiming..etc).
Map length is not the only factor that was changed but it still contributes heavily to players quitting. The knowledge increase and experience doesn't have much to do with a short map if anything from that we should then increase map length. Also what does the ease of competition have to do with map length? The reason people liked gontroller wasn't due to ease of competition if that is relevant to the point you were trying to make.

Additionally, on Gontroller map end dates were never planned in advance. They were decided based on the server itself and when things started to die down and "felt" right and on servers maps became shorter because maps died out faster and players moved on elsewhere. Also most players today are used to and prefer knowing a set date on when things will end and a goal to work towards so we have to try and consider an approximation of when to go forward with things. Ending a map too soon would kill the momentum yet dragging it on too long after its already died out is just as problematic. It's a difficult balance to try and find.
This I like, I like how map 3 on gontroller since it never felt right to "cut the map short" It went on for almost a year lol. But what I know for certain is that one month maps are cancer.
Gontroller was also very unique in that we have had an incredibly loyal and skilled playerbase who, even after all these years return to share their memories and experiences on the server, however much of the Factions playerbase today is loyal to their Faction and the competition rather than the server or those running it.
With this in mind, do you believe that these players who only come from gontroller and will be coming back will enjoy /fly, printer, 1 month maps and all the other cancer? I am that player. I am/was an incredibly loyal and skilled player who has years of memories and experience on gontroller. I've been playing vanity for like a week and a half just to see where the current state of factions is right now. I've never been so disappointed in my life. and yet that's the direction you want gontroller to go in. How about set a new standard? Instead of copying what doesn't work just do your own shit. You have such an advantage over these other servers with all your oldgen players coming back and yet you simply are not capitalizing on it. You've never knew what your playerbase wanted in the past and you guys still have yet a clue to what they want now.

To get back to the map length in specific. Let's say you're playing gontroller. It's map 5 and you've just logged onto gontroller for the first time just to see an announcement that the server will be resetting in a month from now. That new player isn't even going to bother starting up on gontroller to see all his hardwork be reset in 30 days from then. He probably will forget to even come back to gontroller when the map finally does reset because everything in the last weeks means nothing. and yet factions today only has the means nothing part.

Of course we're looking to identify problems which is why we've been actively taking feedback from the community and those who are looking to play (Including your opinions here), but simply returning to what Gontroller used to be 4+ years ago would not do that because the playerbase has changed. People are older (although in many cases not necessarily grown up), many have moved on from the game entirely and the way people play the game and what they expect from the game has evolved along side their knowledge and intricate understanding of the more complex Minecraft mechanics.
I'm not trying to revert everything back to what gontroller used to be 4 years ago, but identifying what made it so enjoyable back then verse what make it non enjoyable in the slightest today. There's a huge difference between blindly forcing what it used to be and seeing where factions went wrong and what people enjoy. In searching towards what people enjoyed takes you then back to that time period then it so happens to be that time period. Yea the players got older but so did I from map 3-5. So did I from cod WaW to black ops 2 (4 years in between those 2 games) Yet I still loved them both. In fact I actually liked black ops 1/2 arguably more than waw and they came out later. It just so happened to be the later game was better. and it so happens to be that the cancer for factions mc is around in a later time period.

I don't like some stuff, I do like some stuff it just happens to be that most of the stuff that isn't enjoyable is around right now.
Adapting to and incorporating new changes within the Factions community, whilst exploring some new additions of our own and hoping to both bring Factions forward and retaining the feel that old Gontroller had, is a difficult task but one that all members of the staff team are eager to try and achieve but the only way to do that is through a collaboration between the staff team and the community. We certainly don't know everything, so tell us all that you think we've done wrong and why.
I do respect that you seem to actually be considering what players are saying. I say "seem" because I'm still skeptical; as that is where gontroller collapsed. The lack of knowing what the players wanted or simply ignoring it. We all wanted to be able to not have to spend 5+ hours a day on walls and there were a LOT of forum posts about it with a lot of support and traction. Yet you guys knew what the playerbase wanted and did nothing about it. This was the final thing that made every single player that was loyal to gontroller lose respect. It was EVERYTHING before that but you realize that towards the end of map 5 to the beginning of map 6 there was a mass exodus of players? I bet you guys still have no clue as to why or maybe you have theories but why around that 3-5 month time period? This is why. Not this is why and I'm about to tell you. I mean literally this is why. The fact that you guys don't know why players left in that time period. You don't know why things went wrong when they went wrong and you don't know why things went right when they went right. That is an example of why gontroller failed.
 

Ledo_5678

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Oct 11, 2013
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Yeah I do agree. I've always hated the idea of having really short maps, and I can't imagine higher staff can possibly be very motivated to put so much hard work into a server when it's only going to be around for a month? I much preferred when servers used to have at least 4 month maps, but I do understand the way people play has evolved quite a lot and so i'd be happy to settle for a 2 - 3 month map.

In response to the point that factions quit when they're raided once, yeah that's true, and yeah if that happens then having longer maps is going to mean that a longer proportion of the map is dead, but how is shortening the entire map the problem? Effort should be made to find other ways to balance the map so that factions don't quit, the map shouldn't just be shortened out of fear that people quit after being raided once.

Also, to the point that every other server has 1 month maps for a reason, isn't the whole thing that people are looking forward to is playing Gontroller because it's Gontroller? People want the same, good, nostalgic experience that they had when they played years ago, so copying all the new servers won't do.
If we settle for 2-3 months though I feel like 90% of of the player base will just be settling for the 10% who end up never playing so we're settling for imaginary people who don't exist. like where are they? I have yet to see one person say they love short maps on this thread or over discord.

There's also a couple things about short maps and players quitting. Maybe since they're raided 2 weeks and 1 day into the server they don't want to rebuild because there's THIRTEEN DAYS left till reset. Also let's say the maps regressed because players would quit etc, Maybe if players don't want to play your server after a month of it being up, then possibly it's just a shit server.
 
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Infiniti

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If we settle for 2-3 months though I feel like 90% of of the player base will just be settling for the 10% who end up never playing so we're settling for imaginary people who don't exist. like where are they? I have yet to see one person say they love short maps on this thread or over discord.

There's also a couple things about short maps and players quitting. Maybe since they're raided 2 weeks and 1 day into the server they don't want to rebuild because there's THIRTEEN DAYS left till reset. Also let's say the maps regressed because players would quit etc, Maybe if players don't want to play your server after a month of it being up, then possibly it's just a shit server.
I would say the first 3 months of all the servers i've played are the prime times and they do start to die off after that. If it's gonna be a longer map than that it's not really even worth mentioning the map length and more waiting until the time feels right to reset it.

I only say 2 - 3 months cus i'm hoping it'll span my entire summer aha
 

Erick8OO8

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what if the map world border started at 2k and after 2 month pass the world border extends to 5k. That way factions who only wish to play for the start can go ahead and build on world border, but factions who wish to stay in the long run make 4 sided bases
 

SlyPlane

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what if the map world border started at 2k and after 2 month pass the world border extends to 5k. That way factions who only wish to play for the start can go ahead and build on world border, but factions who wish to stay in the long run make 4 sided bases
2kx2k is veeeery small. A base with 20 chunk borders is already more than 640 blocks long. It would also mean that after 2 months the map (area) gets 6 times larger.
 

SlyPlane

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I'm not sure if people would hate this, but I personally wouldn't have anything against maps being extended (or shortened) from the announced end date if it doesn't feel right. Maybe there could be a poll put up 2 months before the map is supposed to end asking whether it should just end earlier. Then a poll 2-4 weeks before it ends seeing whether it should be extended. Obivously, a VAST majority only should decide on this. Eg, a 145 for versus 130 vote against should mean it shouldn't be changed. Maybe a 2/3 majority (ish) only could decide something like this.
 

Parted

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I'm not sure if people would hate this, but I personally wouldn't have anything against maps being extended (or shortened) from the announced end date if it doesn't feel right. Maybe there could be a poll put up 2 months before the map is supposed to end asking whether it should just end earlier. Then a poll 2-4 weeks before it ends seeing whether it should be extended. Obivously, a VAST majority only should decide on this. Eg, a 145 for versus 130 vote against should mean it shouldn't be changed. Maybe a 2/3 majority (ish) only could decide something like this.
Some of us staff were talking about not having a set length and resetting whenever the map was dead/stale like @Substance mentioned but its still up for debate.
 

Ledo_5678

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Oct 11, 2013
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Some of us staff were talking about not having a set length and resetting whenever the map was dead/stale like @Substance mentioned but its still up for debate.
Any plans to not have a busted economy? Or is tnt going to essentially be free like all the other servers.
 

Parted

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Any plans to not have a busted economy? Or is tnt going to essentially be free like all the other servers.
What do you mean by busted economy? We are going to be testing it to make sure its balanced, and no TNT will not be super easy to get like every other server
 
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Vilanoxx

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If we settle for 2-3 months though I feel like 90% of of the player base will just be settling for the 10% who end up never playing so we're settling for imaginary people who don't exist. like where are they? I have yet to see one person say they love short maps on this thread or over discord.

There's also a couple things about short maps and players quitting. Maybe since they're raided 2 weeks and 1 day into the server they don't want to rebuild because there's THIRTEEN DAYS left till reset. Also let's say the maps regressed because players would quit etc, Maybe if players don't want to play your server after a month of it being up, then possibly it's just a shit server.
Someone give this man a reality check, he's giving me a migraine.

It's a matter of days, not weeks, not months, once TNT enables that every relevant faction will get raided and there will be just one faction sitting at the top, this is no different than if the map were long or short. You'd be crying for them to end the map early if a faction were to get to a point where they could mine all of their wealth and be absolutely uncontested at the #1 spot for the rest of the map. And factions rarely ever join a map late, because people these days play to compete for f top instead of roleplaying a blockgame MMO. You spend a lot of effort making your opinion known on how you want maps to be short, but you have no relevant points as to why they should be short at all. Most factions get sick of the map even when it's 3-4 weeks long, and here you're crying that people quit when you're playing a gamemode that's all about making your enemies fuck off. You can't simply water down a gamemode that has progressed literally years beyond the time when it was normal to have month-long maps on most servers because no one plays the way people did back then. And what's this bullshit about players not wanting to play after a month, are you new around here or something? People stay on the server until it ends- that is, if they don't need to wait a quarter of the year for that to happen. It has nothing to do with the quality of the server if people don't want to play it after a month- if people get raided and they feel like quitting then that's on them and the people who raided them, not the server.
 

gir99

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Someone give this man a reality check, he's giving me a migraine.

It's a matter of days, not weeks, not months, once TNT enables that every relevant faction will get raided and there will be just one faction sitting at the top, this is no different than if the map were long or short. You'd be crying for them to end the map early if a faction were to get to a point where they could mine all of their wealth and be absolutely uncontested at the #1 spot for the rest of the map. And factions rarely ever join a map late, because people these days play to compete for f top instead of roleplaying a blockgame MMO. You spend a lot of effort making your opinion known on how you want maps to be short, but you have no relevant points as to why they should be short at all. Most factions get sick of the map even when it's 3-4 weeks long, and here you're crying that people quit when you're playing a gamemode that's all about making your enemies fuck off. You can't simply water down a gamemode that has progressed literally years beyond the time when it was normal to have month-long maps on most servers because no one plays the way people did back then. And what's this bullshit about players not wanting to play after a month, are you new around here or something? People stay on the server until it ends- that is, if they don't need to wait a quarter of the year for that to happen. It has nothing to do with the quality of the server if people don't want to play it after a month- if people get raided and they feel like quitting then that's on them and the people who raided them, not the server.
I think you summed up the reality of it
 
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olzy

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Maps got shorter because people didn't want to rebuild not the other way round. No one wants to check walls on the same base for 6 months
 
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